Tia Keenan is a chef fromager, teacher, culinary consultant and cheese rock star based in New York City. I’ve known Keenan for over five years, and her originality and culinary daring never cease to inspire me.
Keenan began her career as a restaurant-based cheese specialist and chef, known for her innovative programs at Union Square Hospitality Group's The Modern and at Casellula, which is recognized as a pioneer in the cheese-focused restaurant format. She has worked with clients ranging from multi-national companies like Disney to smaller, distinctive brands like Murray’s Cheese and Bien Cuit Bakery. Keenan’s unique, holistic approach to establishing and growing food-based businesses encompasses many areas of expertise, including strategy, branding, marketing, design, and execution of ambitious, cutting edge food-focused brands. Her work has been praised in various media outlets, including Food & Wine, The New York Times, The New Yorker and The Cooking Channel. Keenan lives in Queens with her husband, award-winning sommelier Hristo Zisovski, and their son.
Raymond Hook: Can you explain exactly what a cheese chef is?
Tia Keenan: Well, I started cooking professionally because I wanted to elaborate on my work with cheese. I wanted to make condiments and cheese-focused dishes that were more and more involved. I wouldn’t call myself a “cheese chef” per se, but some people DO call me that. I guess I think of myself as most similar to a sushi chef, in that one type of protein is my focus, and I try to keep it simple and let the product speak for itself.
What are your thoughts on the standardized “three cheeses, almonds, quince paste and fruit bread” cheese plate that is ubiquitous in New York City restaurants?
Listen, I’m happy that more and more restaurants offer cheese plates at all. I’m a “big picture” type of gal. Sure, many of them are somewhat thoughtless, in that they rely on the three-cheese-almonds-quince-paste-fruit-and-nut-bread paradigm, but that doesn’t bother me. The important thing is to get people eating cheese. That standard cheese plate is a gateway for many a cheese lover. What’s important is the quality of the cheese – a good cheese stands alone. One could theoretically leave the quince paste on the plate for the dishwasher to scrape off.
How well does the general “fine dining” customer know cheese?
I’ve seen an incredible evolution over the years of customer knowledge of the cheese. People are so sophisticated now in terms of knowing what they personally like, and then their general knowledge of cheese and even the cheese making process. I think the knowledge is less class-based and more generational. Starting with Gen X, people are just really, really into food. Gen Y are food obsessives. It’s awesome.
What’s your favorite must-read cheese book?
The Cheese Chronicles by Liz Thorpe. I just love how she tells stories. Also, she’s a close friend and I was with her on some of the cheese trips she writes about in the book!
What is a simple can't-miss cheese pairing?
Good blue cheese and a very dark chocolate.
What is your absolute favorite place to eat cheese in New York City?
My home. I mean, I’ve kind of ruined myself for cheese experiences that other people or places offer me. I’m the gal who made blue cheese nori rolls! And I’m a control freak. If I want cheese, I buy it and serve it myself. I do a lot of Raclette at home. It’s easy to set up and my guests always love it – low effort, high impact.
How did you get so many Twitter followers? It’s impressive!
I think people respond to my Twitter feed because it’s a mix of Tweets about cheese, dairy, restaurants and food politics with observations and confessions about my personal life. I tweet about what interests me, and people respond to the authenticity of my feed. Also, I’m not afraid to talk about sex and be provocative. People love that. I engage. I hate people who don’t have conversations on Twitter, like they just tweet at you, not with you. Why would I want to be talked at all day? I like to talk back!
Do you have a "guilty" cheese pleasure?
Dill Havarti ALL THE WAY. Also, I like cheddar with horseradish. But seriously, I always have Boar’s Head Havarti with Dill in my refrigerator. Always.
Your husband is a big time sommelier; who wins when you have a gourmet throw-down?
Once we did a blind tasting of about twenty foods. To someone who’s never done that before, it sounds easy…but it’s not. When you try something – an ingredient, like, say, cumin – it’s not always easy to identify it. Then when you do that with twenty flavors at a time...it’s not easy. Anyway, we did that and I totally schooled him. He actually admitted I have a better palate. But really, I think I just have a good flavor memory. I can remember the nuances of flavors, and that’s what having a “good palate” really is.
Why did you become a cheese chef in the first place?
Because I always need to do things my own unique way, and I didn’t have the patience to wait for people who would understand what I was trying to do. So I did it for myself. And I still do it for myself.
Additional reporting by Madeleine James.
- An Australian woman has shown off her impressive fire-pit damper recipe
- The loaf takes about 40 minutes to cooks and calls for flour, beer and bacon
- The cheese, garlic and bacon loaf is cooked in a camp oven, on hot coal
Published: 06:39 BST, 19 April 2021 | Updated: 09:00 BST, 19 April 2021
A home cook has revealed her recipe for a cheese, bacon and garlic pull-apart and it can be cooked on the fire.
The Queensland mum showed off a video of the cheese-loaded damper on a camp oven recipe page on Facebook.
And fellow campers were impressed - with the post attracting hundreds of comments and reactions when it was posted on Sunday.
A home cook has revealed her recipe for a cheese, bacon and garlic pull-apart and it can be cooked on the fire
The Queensland mum showed off a video of the cheese-loaded damper on a camp oven recipe page on Facebook
'Made a cheese, bacon and garlic pull apart damper on the weekend,' she said - posting the picture and video to show off the delicious snack.
The home cook who told Daily Mail Australia she cooks with her heart later shared a recipe for the dish - but warned it is up to each person to tweak as she doesn't usually go by measurements herself.
But the important components of the recipe include self raising flour, one can of Great Northern beer, bacon, cheese and garlic butter.
Students discover the joys of cooking
Lunches at Notre Dame’s two dining halls, where most of us eat twice a day, seven days a week, can turn monotonous about eight weeks into the semester, but we rejoice at the convenience of a hot and nutritious meal always at the ready. Still, when the most popular dishes in the dining hall include chicken strips, chargrilled chicken and General Tso’s, it’s no wonder we feel like we’ve fallen into a culinary rut. And when we hit the point where we can’t possibly look at another fillet of unidentifiable fish, it’s time to get creative.
Thankfully, the dining halls are equipped to adapt to the constantly changing tastes of the student body. Over the past few years, the fare has become healthier, more seasonal and more diverse. The chefs and dining hall managers read our comment cards and more than 700 student survey responses every semester. They meet with student government and host sample-and-vote opportunities when it comes time to choose a new ice cream or cereal.
The dining halls also provide plenty of raw ingredients with which students can cook for themselves. During his sophomore year, senior Thomas Graff experimented by crossing different international cuisines. In search of more fusion cuisine ideas, he started his own Facebook group, Eat Like a Champion Today, in September 2012, to collect and sample the dining hall recipes of his peers. At first, he invited just a few of his cooking-inclined friends, but soon it exploded into an almost 200-member gourmet forum.
For a main course, Graff likes to make chicken fajitas. He starts with a garlic and herb tortilla, and then gathers cheddar cheese, thinly-sliced bell peppers, baby spinach, red onions and grilled chicken.
“It’s thinking about how you can mix together different islands and different food groups,” Graff says. “Here’s the fun part.” He throws his vegetables onto the Panini press, getting an even heat by flipping them every minute or so with tongs.
“We think that the food here is boring or usual, but you can always be creative and discover something new. Every meal is an opportunity to improve.” When finished, Graff plops his perfectly grilled tortilla onto his plate. “That’s a wrap!” he says.
Graff’s layered dessert is easy, too: a dab of vanilla yogurt, a gooey slab of peanut butter, dried cranberries from the salad aisle and a healthy serving of honey.
The foodies who follow “Eat Like a Champion” are rare birds. For most, the extra 10 to 15 minutes it takes to create something original is time that could have been spent finishing homework, getting to class on time or squeezing in one last episode of New Girl. It’s so easy to fall into line behind the droves of students waiting for ready-to-eat home-style or Mexican meals — just one stop for a preset plate of a protein, a carbohydrate and some vegetables, and you’re good to go. Enthusiasm for culinary diversity certainly spikes when it’s Greek or Indian day, but there’s more to Mediterranean cuisine than gyros, and the typical Notre Dame student wouldn’t know it. Despite the variety, the average Notre Dame plate features chicken, steamed vegetables and the ubiquitous, mobile side dish: a banana.
But for these 170-odd burgeoning chefs, the minutes invested at the grill or bouncing from one line to another are minutes well spent. Every week they post two to three new recipes, such as Graff’s revamped hummus dish with olive oil, cayenne pepper and red peppers. If a member tests out the recipe, they’ll likely comment on the post. Graff’s hummus got a resounding “Hella!” two minutes after he shared it.
“Food is another way to approach your own life and creativity and how you make old things new,” Graff says. “How do we make discoveries? What does it mean to have an insight? Cooking is a physical way of asking these questions. It’s how you make new connections between foods and just have fun with it. Most of our lives we go through routines and have a context and limits in which we work. Within those limits there are opportunities to see new things and then enjoy it.”
In the dorms, cooking for one seems futile because most of the kitchens are woefully unequipped. Unless a dorm was built after 1990, the kitchen usually features a temperamental oven, a few lost spoons and leftover hot dog buns from the last dorm grill-out. Getting the ingredients and tools needed to bake desserts, let alone a meal for one, is too time-consuming to be enjoyable — unless you’re senior Adam Joslyn, who makes delectable desserts in his Keough Hall kitchen.
Joslyn started baking when he was in high school. Tired of watching movies, he and his then-girlfriend started experimenting with cupcake and cookie recipes, and soon were hooked.
At Notre Dame, Joslyn found his friends had nothing to do on Thursday nights, so he started baking treats in Keough Hall’s kitchen. Week after week he would try new recipes, filling the hall with the smells of vanilla, chocolate, cinnamon and peanut butter. People would flock from all over the dorm, and then from all over campus, to hang out in the kitchen with Joslyn and enjoy his finished products. Soon it was common to find students munching on Joslyn’s cupcakes while watching movies into the wee hours of Friday morning. Joslyn became “That Baking Guy” among the ever-hungry underclassmen.
He spends about $200 per year in Flex Points on baking supplies. (Imagine the looks you’d get checking out at the Huddle Mart with just eight packages of butter.) Several pots, pans, beaters, tins and mixing bowls live in his dorm room, keeping would-be pilferers from snatching them out of the kitchen cupboards.
Today, Joslyn fields requests from friends and strangers alike to deliver his goods from Keough’s oven to locations across campus. Satisfied customers have included students in residential halls, libraries and even some classrooms. Demand rises when Joslyn proudly posts his completed creations on Facebook requests come pouring in via comments on the tantalizing pictures.
The math major is looking to impress potential employers with his baking skills. “Whoever hires me is going to be very lucky — I’ll be baking for them hopefully every week.” He even debated bringing a batch of fresh cupcakes to an interview in Chicago with an event-production agency. “I couldn’t have them thinking I was all talk,” he says. “If anything, it gives them an insight into my personality. It’s a subtle way of saying, ‘Hey, there’s more.’”
Many halls operate food sales out of their kitchens to support dorm events and feed residents late into the night. Run by their respective hall governments, Morrissey Manor has Yaz’s, “serving the best in frozen foods since 2001.” McGlinn Hall hosts the Shamrock Snack Shack, baking cupcakes, cookies and birthday cakes. Keenan Hall’s student-run pizzeria, Zaland, serves fresh cheese, pepperoni and sausage pizzas every night for late study sessions and dorm events.
At Zaland, whole pizzas cost from $6 to $7 depending on the toppings, but one slice is only $1. Zaland has its own pizza oven, and its cooks may start making homemade dough for special occasions, says senior Kevin McGinn, who has worked in the kitchen since he was a sophomore. As this year’s manager of Zaland, McGinn is in charge of ordering all the pizzeria’s ingredients. His Wednesday night shift goes from 9:30 until midnight, but on weekends, pizzas are served hot until 2:30 a.m.
“It’s a great way to give back to the dorm, see everyone and provide pizza where it’s needed,” McGinn said. Zaland doesn’t deliver yet but may soon serve other halls on North Quad.
Zaland sees an uptick in customers during the winter months when residents are less likely to venture out to find late-night sustenance. McGinn has seen packs of Stanford residents cross the hallway that connects the two dorms to clear out the Zaland stock. Zaland pizza is most popular during exam week, halftime during Irish away games and Super Bowl weekend.
“All the funds go back into Keenan to support the dorm,” McGinn said. “We give the pizza to the hall staff for free to thank them for all their hard work, and any pizza that’s left over after closing is free, too. That usually draws quite a swarm.”
The breakfast spread at South Dining Hall is one of the best parts of the Notre Dame experience. There’s fruit, freshly baked muffins, custom omelets, The New York Times and unlimited coffee. Those who have a 9:30 class can be seen yawning over their scrambled eggs and bacon at either cafeteria, and on the weekends, North Dining Hall serves incredible strawberry and blueberry crepes, drizzled with chocolate and caramel.
Breakfast is the most important meal of the day, especially for students, so senior Gina Rogari wakes up before her roommates to brew her own coffee, listen to Mumford & Sons and take her time making whatever she likes in the comfort of her own off-campus kitchen.
What off-campus students without meal plans lose in convenience, they often make up for in originality. Rogari makes her own bread, granola and signature avocado and rosemary egg sandwiches. She says cooking for herself is 90 percent mental.
“If you start feeling like cooking is something you have to do and don’t want to do, you’ll eat frozen pizza, pasta and cereal every night for an entire month,” she says. “If you strive to make a few creative things each week for dinner or breakfast, it becomes a whole new ballgame.
“I love proving to myself that I can make something as good or better than something you can find in a restaurant. I love when you set out to copy a recipe in a beautiful cookbook and actually succeed. I love when other people appreciate your efforts, and I love knowing I’ll spend more time enjoying a meal if it took more than three minutes to prepare.”
Still, Rogari misses the creature comforts the dining halls offer: the selection, the frozen yogurt, the waffles, the companionship. “The food is always hot, there is always chocolate milk, and you can always go back for more,” she says. “If anyone has an RSVP meal burning a hole in his pocket, I wouldn’t decline it.”
Rogari’s roommate, senior Meredith Houska, prefers baking off-campus because she can experiment more and have all her cooking and baking tools on hand. While Martin’s Supermarket is her customary grocery, Houska shops the new Whole Foods Market on Grape Road and South Bend Farmers’ Market for some items.
Typical desserts for Houska include cheesecakes and cookies, but she occasionally will make a pie. “My love for baking started as something that I did with my mom. It’s always been our time together. Now I use it as a stress reliever and something to break up my day. Baking allows me to share treats with friends and hopefully make their day a little sweeter,” she says.
Senior Carolyn Green, who lives on campus, frequently visits the kitchen Houska and Rogari share to cook and bake. Green writes a cooking blog for The Columbian, the newspaper in her hometown of Portland, Oregon, and almost every time she bakes, she tries a new recipe she’s found on Pinterest. Her healthy dinners often include seafood, thanks to her Pacific Northwest love of fresh fish.
When Green was about 3 years old, her father gave her mother cooking lessons for her birthday. But since her mother was on bed rest, her father wound up attending the lessons instead, discovering a passion for the kitchen and becoming a household gourmet chef. Green eventually learned her father’s specialties — shrimp risotto, deep-dish stuffed-spinach pizza and pork tenderloin fajitas — so she eats well and spends less on dining out in South Bend.
Saving money does cost Green precious time planning a meal, driving to the store, shopping, cooking, eating and cleaning up. But, she says, “Cooking is something I do to relax.”
For these students like Green, following a recipe and measuring out ingredients is just enough mental engagement to distract them from an impending accounting exam. Hearing roommates inhale and exclaim, “That smells amazing,” can be as rewarding as acing a philosophy paper. It’s another way to get that accomplishment fix, to satisfy the craving for success that got them to Notre Dame in the first place.
Alec Samolczyk likes how cooking creates a casual celebration. In his off-campus kitchen, he can produce a meal that brings his friends together, replacing a common dining hall experience.
For recipes and inspiration Samolcyzk looks to Bon Appetit Magazine and his favorite chefs, Eric Ripert, David Cheng and Fergus Henderson. He tries to cook seasonally as much as possible. “My favorite winter meal is one that takes all day to make: red-wine braised short ribs with creamy polenta,” he says. “It’s a family favorite that makes the whole house smell so good.”
Samolczyk started teaching himself to cook when he was in elementary school by reading cookbooks and magazines, and watching the Food Network. He eventually took over grilling responsibilities for his father. This past Thanksgiving marked the eighth year in a row he prepared the dinner for his family solo. He does the same for Christmas and New Year’s.
“I would like to work the business end of cooking as a restaurateur,” the senior finance and economics major says. “A meal, to me, is about more than just the food it’s about the experience that comes along with it.”
A meal at Notre Dame is more than just what’s on the menu. It means packing a kitchen with roommates for fresh bread. It means taking a break to make someone a birthday cake. It means settling into chairs alongside our classmates and letting the whole world shrink down to this intimate wooden table, just for an hour. It means savoring the ruckus, the laughter, the creativity and the flavor — the true taste of home cooking.
Meghan Thomassen is managing editor of The Observer and was this magazine’s autumn intern.
Hooked on Cheese: Interview with Tia Keenan, Cheese Rebel - Recipes
Interview With Dr. Phil McGraw
Aired May 29, 2004 - 21:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
LARRY KING, HOST: Tonight, Dr. Phil McGraw. He shaped up your attitude, and how it's your shape. And when it comes to your health, Dr. Phil says, Get real. And he's here for the hour next on LARRY KING LIVE.
It's always great to welcome Dr. Phil to this program, the host of the highly-rated syndicated daytime show. His new book is "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook: Recipes for Weight-Loss Freedom." There you see its cover. His previous book, "The Ultimate Weight Solution," was a No. 1 "New York Times" best-seller. He is on the cover of this week's "TV Guide." The man has exploded.
By the way, this is Wednesday night. On Monday night, the winner of the "Dr. Phil Weight Loss Challenge" was announced on his show. Let's watch.
DR. PHIL MCGRAW: Jim, I know how competitive you are, and I've only got one thing to say to you at this point. You are the "Ultimate Weight Loss Challenge" winner! All right! All right!
KING: That winner was James -- Jim Toth, a 33-year-old radio sidekick who made a career out of a fat, lovable loser, who started at 360 pounds and ended at 230. And what did he get for winning?
MCGRAW: Oh, man. He made out like a bandit, I'll tell you what! I think the No. 1 thing he got, Larry, was to get his life back and his life in order. When we first met Jim, he submitted a tape, like so many others, that said, I'm overwhelmed. I have so far to go that I just don't feel like I can get there.
He was well over 300 pounds. He was, like, 365, something like that.
And my approach with the "Ultimate Weight Challenge," and the approach in the book, was that it's not about dieting. I think dieting is one of the biggest scams in America today. It's a multi- billion-dollar industry, and it doesn't work.
MCGRAW: It's a scam. I mean, look, when you go and -- when you're talking to people and you're saying, you know, 30 days to the new you -- those people that are selling that, 30 pounds in 30 days, that kind of thing, they've read the same research I've read, which is that 90-plus percent of the people gain the weight back in a very short period of time, plus some.
MCGRAW: They gain, like, 110, 120 pounds back. Well, think of it. If you -- if you have lifestyle A, and it makes you overweight, so you go to lifestyle B -- a diet -- and you lose weight, well what happens when you go back to lifestyle A? I mean, when you choose the behavior, you choose the consequences. You go on a diet, which means you come off of the diet. And when you come off, you rebound. And -- important point -- people that are on these yo-yo diets are 70 percent more likely to die of some cardiac event than people who never dieted a day in their life. It ruins your health to do that. That's why I say it's a scam.
KING: Now, Doctor, being honest -- and it's Letterman (ph) (UNINTELLIGIBLE) -- you are not underweight. You are not a slim person. Was it a risk for you, who certainly -- what we call in the Jewish faith shtarker (ph) to do this?
KING: Shtarker could be a compliment.
MCGRAW: What is -- oh, that's a good thing?
KING: I would call a -- a defensive lineman could be a shtarker.
MCGRAW: All right. Speak English. This is America.
MCGRAW: No, when I'm -- listen, when I talk about "get real weight" -- I spent my whole life, up through the end of high school, built a lot like you are now. I've seen more meat on antlers than you've got on you now.
MCGRAW: But I was tall and skinny. When I went to college, I changed positions. I was playing football. I changed positions, and they had me in the weight room every day, pumping iron and drinking this nutrient to gain weight. And so I bulked up. And I am a big guy, and for me.
MCGRAW: It depends on how you define it. See, that's one of the problems. In America, if you go to the charts that we use today, I would be overweight. Michael Jordan would be overweight. Arnold Schwarzenegger would be overweight. A lot of people that are athletic would be overweight because they have a disproportionate muscle mass. Now, my body fat runs around 18 percent, which is normal and, you know, kind of in the middle of normal, actually.
MCGRAW: But my overall weight is high. I weigh, like, 240 pounds, and that hasn't changed in probably 20 years.
KING: But did you run a risk, weighing 240, to have people say, How can someone 240 pounds help me lose weight?
MCGRAW: Oh, I think so because people have this media image of what people are supposed to weigh. You see it when you -- you listen to women talk about it. They -- they look at the stars on television and say, I want to look like her. Or they say, I weighed 105 pounds when I graduated from high school. I loved my shape then. That's my goal.
Well, let me tell you, if you're 45, had three children and are post-menopausal, you're not going to weigh what you did the day you graduated from high school. Get that out of your head. That's a media-driven ideal that you're never going to healthfully obtain. Now, you can starve yourself and you can lose muscle mass and get down to that, but that is not healthy.
What I want people to do is what's healthy for them. And my weight for me is my healthy natural weight. I don't struggle to keep it. My body fat is very low. I run five miles a day, plus play tennis in the afternoon. I'm probably in the best shape of my life.
KING: All right. So is it all mental? So if I think I'm overweight, am I overweight?
MCGRAW: No. No. You have to look at it a number of different ways. And you know, first off, there are seven keys that I talk about. And when people -- look, I could have sold a lot more books if I'd have said, "Dr. Phil's Miracle Diet: The New You." Easy. You know, Lose weight while you sleep. I didn't say any of that. If you look at my book, what I say in the very beginning is -- what I say in the very beginning is, This is not easy, but it is doable. This is manageable. Because I want people to understand you can do this, but you don't have to starve yourself to do it. You don't have to be deprived to do it. You just have to work at it.
KING: Tell me about the cookbook that follows it. You are not a cook, I understand.
MCGRAW: No. KING: You're a barbecue guy, right?
KING: So how did this come about?
MCGRAW: I throw it on the grill until I torch it, and then I bring it in. But we have a lifestyle in our family, we have a lifestyle where we eat in a way that is consistent with stable, healthy weight. That's what we've always done.
KING: By the way, this book, for the benefit of viewers, just came out yesterday and is in all stores now.
MCGRAW: It is. And what it includes is over 100 recipes that you don't -- 100 recipes that you don't need Wolfgang Puck to prepare. These are things that you can eat at home. They're things that you can cook at home. And they're things that are what I call "high response cost, high yield foods." And there's a real simple categorization of foods. If you don't have to work very hard to ingest food that you're eating, chances -- that's what I call "low response cost" -- chances are pretty good that's not good for you. That means it's highly processed, it's high in fat, it's high in the wrong kinds of carbohydrates. And you can take a bean and sour cream burrito, for example. I mean, you can just inhale those. You don't even have to swallow. You don't even have to chew, you just have to swallow. So the idea is, if you eat a "high response cost" food, it's something that you have to actually -- you have to actually work to ingest. You have to prepare it. You have to chew it. You have to work to ingest the food. It's probably got the fiber that you need. It's got the nutrients that you need. It's fresher. It's less processed. And it's going to be good for you.
KING: Probably a good -- that's a good tip. I just thought of.
We'll be right back with Dr. Phil. The new book is "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook: Recipes for Weight-Loss Freedom." Dr. Phil's our guest. We'll be right back.
JIM TOTH, WEIGHT LOSS CHALLENGE WINNER: I'm pretty close to death (ph) at this weight. I'm very close to a divorce because of my weight. I need help.
They call me "Lumpy" on the radio station. It's me. It's not too much of a character.
MCGRAW: I don't want to change what the scale says, I want to change Jim.
Do you think this is going to work for you?
TOTH: I want it to, but I don't know.
When I came out this time, I fit into one seat, and I did not need the seatbelt extender.
TOTH: That's so great (UNINTELLIGIBLE)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Forty-two. Are you kidding me?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Babe, that's great!
TOTH: It's affected my relationship with my wife in a positive way.
MCGRAW: You've seen him work all seven keys. He's happier. He's healthier. He's.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: . my inside, I feel like I've lost 6,000 pounds.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have been selected to undergo an extreme makeover!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If I can look as beautiful as I feel on the inside, for the first time in my life then I'm truly going to be a beautiful person.
MCGRAW: The moment that was unveiled on "Extreme Makeover" on ABC a few weeks ago, but none of the challengers or me have seen her in over three months. Will the new Monica come on out?
KING: Why, Dr. Phil, does it feel so good when you lose it?
MCGRAW: Because people tend to confuse self-image with body image. Now, think about that. I've talked to so many people, men and women alike, that get overweight and their self-esteem just goes in the tank. They think they're judged. They think they're unattractive. They're just not proud of the physique or the figure that they offer when they walk in a room. And so body image and self- image, which are two separate issues, go down at the same time. And when people lose the weight, then their body image comes up and it pulls their self-image up with it.
Now, those two things should not vary together because, I promise you, Monica was the same loving, giving, caring spirit at her top weight as she is at her ideal weight. And that's why I say if you're going to lose weight and keep it off -- now, you can keep telling yourself what you want to hear. You can keep believing the ads. You can keep buying the promises. Or you can simply say, Look, I'm going to do this right one time, and I'm going to recognize that, No. 1, I got to change the way I think. I got to change.
KING: What part of this, Phil, has nothing to do with anything but aging and genes? You notice that some women will get older and their bottoms will get heavier. Men will get potbellies. Is that natural?
MCGRAW: Of course. That's why I say there has to be a "get real weight," and part of your right thinking. You've got to be honest with yourself and realize that your metabolism is slowing down. You simply cannot eat what you used to eat and burn it off because you're not as -- your metabolism's not as efficient. Your activity level may not be as high. Your body is, in fact, slowing down, and it reacts differently to different foods.
So part of the seven keys is to get right thinking. Stop being unrealistic in what you're telling yourself. Stop judging yourself and letting your self-esteem go with you. You've got to get honest and logical and quit telling yourself what you want to hear. That's key No. 1, and that's critical.
KING: How do I use the cookbook? Is this something -- follow it every day? Is it a 30-day plan? Is it -- this is every meal? What?
MCGRAW: Look, here's the thing. People rebel when they go on diets. I mean, you hear people talk about going on a diet, and the first thing they do is get irritated.
KING: Because they don't like what they're eating.
MCGRAW: Well, that's right. They don't like what they're eating and -- I hear people say, You all going on vacation this summer? Oh, what's the point. I can't eat. I'm on a diet. Well, you weren't going over there to just eat, you were going to see the sights, see the people, have a good time, do different activities. But people tie food so much to their quality life. And so what happens is -- diets are restrictive. We put people on diets, and when they're restricted, they rebel, Larry. They rebel. And when they rebel, it's -- it's to binge on the foods that they couldn't have on the diet.
Now, what the cookbook does -- I got together some of the best chefs in the country, and I hooked them up with my wife, Robin (ph), and with myself, the things that we have enjoyed and found stabilizing over the years. And we put together the recipes and we put together the ingredients that guaranteed that these things were high response cost and had a high nutritional yield. Because I'll tell you, there are certain foods that you can eat that are what are called hunger suppressors. They tend to suppress your hunger drive. There are other foods you can eat that are called hunger drivers. They trigger insulin and blood sugar changes and they drive your hunger.
So What "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook" does is put together over 100 recipes, including side dishes. I mean, we've got everything in the world in there. We've got mashed potatoes in there. We've got -- no-fry chicken-fried steak in there, since I'm from Texas. We have so many of these things that you can eat. And if you eat the recipes in this book, No. 1, you're going to lose weight. And No. 2, you're not going to be hungry and you're not going to feel deprived across time. So the idea.
MCGRAW: Oh, they're absolutely wonderful! I've eaten all of these recipes, and they are absolutely delightful.
KING: That's the hardest thing, don't you think, to accept.
KING: . a food you don't like.
MCGRAW: Yes. And that's the thing. That's what I mean. People rebel. But here -- listen, food is an addictive substance for a lot of people. And you have to realize that when you get into an addiction, you're just talking about a powerful, powerful habit. You've learned what you like, and you can relearn to like different things.
When I was growing up in the South, my mother fixed iced tea for us all the time. She would fix it, and in a half-gallon, she would pour in a cup of sugar and stir it up. And you know, today we call that maple syrup. But then we called it iced tea. If I had -- I learned to like that then. If I drank that today, it would gag me. I mean, it's so syrupy sweet, I just couldn't do it. That was a learned habit. I've now unlearned that and relearned these things, and that would be a negative and the healthy foods are a positive.
KING: Like I learned fat-free milk.
KING: I couldn't stand it. Now I can't drink cream. I can't drink whole milk.
MCGRAW: Yes. Yes. It would feel like you were drinking whipped cream or something.
MCGRAW: It would be terrible for you. So you can relearn these things. There is hope.
KING: Is there danger in -- when we go the other way and lose too much?
KING: Karen Carpenter syndrome.
MCGRAW: Well, there are certainly eating disorders that can be life-threatening scenarios -- bulimia, anorexia and the combination of anorexia and bulimia, as well as some others. But even before you get to those extremes, people who push themselves too far, you can go into a state of loss that your body begins to convert muscle instead of fat for energy, so you're actually breaking down your muscle mass. And You get into all kinds of health problems when you do that.
KING: We'll be right back with more of Dr. Phil. The new book, "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook," now available everywhere. Don't go away.
MCGRAW: His loss of dignity, his loss of self-respect so crippled him, and he just dug his heels in and said, That's enough.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Since I've began the weight loss challenge, I feel like I've been reborn.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Pork rinds, Cheetos.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I look forward to each day to being able to play with my kid. And I just feel like I'm alive again.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I can put my arms all the way around my dad now.
MCGRAW: He has become a leader in America. He'll never gain this weight back. He would not accept that from himself in the future.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This next song is a Joe Cocker tune.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I couldn't tell you today what I'll be doing a year from now, but I know that I'm going to be happy doing it.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm trying to pound it into your head that you are making wrong choices! And you don't get it! And for God's sake, Alexandra, you just seem to think that having sex is like shaking somebody's hand!
MCGRAW: You are the parent here. Your method of engagement is ridiculous. I've been working with you all year, and you go down there and do that!
KING: We ran it -- that could apply to a lot of things, right? Don't yell at people.
MCGRAW: Oh, man! You know, we have spent so much time this year on the show working on people's lifestyles. We've worked on lifestyles with weight, which we've been talking about. We worked on lifestyles with family and relationships because the truth is, you can't have a consistent pattern in your life if you don't have the lifestyle to support it. You can't be overweight if you don't have a lifestyle to support your being overweight. You cannot have a bad marriage or a chaotic family if you don't have a lifestyle that's full of stress, tension, all the things that lead to the conflict. You can't have that kind of bad relationship if you don't have a lifestyle to support that.
And we've been trying to get people to look at their lifestyles, recognize what they're doing to contribute in a toxic way to the results that they're getting.
KING: Now, you said you get addicted to a food and the like. Now, unlike other addictions -- drugs, tobacco, alcohol -- none of those are life necessities. You get onto tobacco, you don't need cigarettes, you get addicted. Food, though, is a necessity of life and also an addiction. So does it compound the problem?
MCGRAW: Dramatically. It is the one substance from which you cannot totally abstain.
MCGRAW: You have an 85 percent failure rate for people who go through alcohol rehabilitation: 85 percent of those people will fail in their attempts to maintain abstinence from the alcohol. Can you imagine what it would be if they had to use alcohol again after they had abused it? It would probably go from 85 to 100 percent. That's what you're dealing with, with food. People that go on a diet and they eat in a healthy fashion, now they have to go back and engage food again. They have to go to a dinner party. They have to go to the holidays. The average weight loss during the holidays is 12 to 15 pounds. That's why I included.
KING: Weight gain, you mean?
MCGRAW: Weight gain, yes. That's why I included in "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook" holiday recipes, so you don't have to pig out during the holidays and gain weight. It's all about lifestyle.
And we worked a lot with the family that we just saw a clip of in changing their lifestyle -- not just giving them some isolated tools, but change the entire fabric of their life. And that has to happen in America.
KING: How much begins in what we tell our children? We have an -- obese children in America at an alarming rate.
MCGRAW: It's more than doubled in the last generation, and 70 percent of children that are obese will become obese adults. So that means that it's going to stick around. And in fact, medical experts tell us today that the current generation, our children today, are the first generation that are not predicted to live longer than their parents did. Because of the obesity epidemic that children are facing, we're seeing adult diseases -- type two diabetes, osteoarthritis, essential hypertension, cardiac problems -- showing up in children that heretofore were reserved only for adults, and it's secondary to obesity.
KING: What about portion control? The United States society suffers portion -- they call it "portion distortion."
MCGRAW: Absolutely. And you know why? Because it's the marketing. See, everybody in America's looking for what they call "value." So if you can get a whole lot for your food dollar, then you think that you've gotten a bargain. Like, Supersize this, you know, for only -- for only 50 cents more, you can get a whole trashcan full of popcorn.
MCGRAW: . at the grocery store or at the -- at the movie. They can roll it down there on casters for you. And everybody thinks, Oh, that's a great deal. But the truth is that the obesity levels in France, for example, are 25 percent of what they are in America. Now, here's an interesting fact. There was a study done of 1,100 restaurants in France and 1,100 restaurants in the United States. They compared them. And the portion size on average for the French restaurants was 25 percent of what you get in America. And interestingly enough, the obesity level is 25 percent of what it is in America.
KING: So even with the dressings and the wine and the like.
MCGRAW: Even with the rich foods, the portion control over there, which is -- that's just what people expect to get. Again, it's a learned pattern. That's what they expect. They say that's a good value. They eat that and go on.
KING: And your contention is you can unlearn it.
MCGRAW: Absolutely, you can unlearn it. Look, it's all habit. It's all habit. And what I'm telling people is you don't need to just change what you eat. That's what a diet does, OK, changes what you eat. But in fact, you need to deal with what you eat, when you eat, where you eat, why you eat, how you eat. You need to deal with all of those things. If you deal with just the one thing, just what you eat, if you just change the food that you choose, you will never lose weight in a lasting and stable way.
For example, people use food emotionally. I mean, we all know that. That's no revelation, by me. We eat emotionally. We celebrate with food. We medicate ourselves with food. If we're depressed, anxious, we medicate ourselves with food. If we're lonely, we companion ourselves with food. I mean, a pizza's never rejected anybody, right? So they go with that.
KING: Our guest is Dr. Phil. And we'll be right back. Don't go away.
MCGRAW: What point in your life did you just decide, I'll just settle to be the fat girl?
What has impressed me is how she has stepped up to be there for herself.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: These were my pants when I started the challenge. They were tight, too!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: No-fail environment -- that was the hardest key for me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I was having a Doritos attack here earlier today!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I would go into these mood swings. I would yell at my sister. Now I can go down and chip (ph) out and not want nothing because I'm truly happy. I'm at peace.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm going to get full custody, full custody.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't think so.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I do. I'm sick of you threatening me, you little (EXPLETIVE DELETED)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Rachel, have I threatened your mom?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: You take them into work and show them a picture of a Web site some guy I've never met and tell the kids I have boyfriend.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Can I tell you something first. I would like to get your full attention. Would you mind holding my hand while I tell you.
MCGRAW: Do you control people that way? I find that to be an unusual request. You don't need to look down there, I want your full attention.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you control people that way? MCGRAW: Pretty much. I'm just real up front about it.
KING: You need to apply this Dr. Phil, the book is the "Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook," in so many areas, can't you?
KING: You can take that same guest that was there and related to cooking.
MCGRAW: We just talked about lifestyle. This is a show that we have done that did a series on the anatomy of divorce. Again, I say, you can't have a bad relationship if you don't have a lifestyle to support it. You can't have a bad divorce if you don't have a lifestyle to support a bad divorce.
And so what we did in this series, was to look at the anatomy of a divorce. We broke down this black hole that people go into. We got a 57.7 percent divorce rate in America today. People don't know what they're getting into.
So, we got the lawyers involved and the judge and the court involved and allow us to take our cameras everywhere and look at the dismantling of this marriage. Now, our goal in doing that, again, was lifestyle.
Our goal was to say, if you get a divorce and you have children, you're not ending a relationship you're changing it. You were friends and lovers, you were companions, you were significant others. You're not going to do that anymore, but you will forever be the co-allies of these children and you don't want them in the middle of a war zone. You have to create a new relationship where you're civil to one another and you have a lifestyle that supports the mutual benefit of these children.
It's -- Larry, it's all about lifestyle. I so strongly believe that we are such creatures of habit, that if I can get people to say, look, there are no sacred cows here, there's nothing I'm not willing to question, there's nothing that I'm not willing to examine and consider changing, if it calls for change, then I can get people to move out of this fixedness they have in their lives and start considering new things.
And "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook" is about saying, look, let's learn a new way to eat, just like you need to learn a new way to be married, a new way to be parents a new way to eat.
KING: You have in this cookbook, banana creme pie, enchiladas, barbeque greens, southern style pot roast and mocha fudge pudding.
MCGRAW: Pretty good stuff, don't you think?
KING: But how can you have a banana cream pie?
MCGRAW: It's all about the ingredients that you put in it. Now, first off.
KING: You have to put bananas and you've got to put cream, right?
MCGRAW: Wrong. You have to have bananas, I'll give you that, you've got to have bananas, but you don't have to have cream. You can use, as we do, non-fat yogurt, instead of cream. You can do all of the things that are smart and high response costs by being creative and come out with the same taste experience that you had going in.
All the things you just named are do-able if you're creative enough to do it. And what I did, was got the best chefs in the country and said, I want this done in a high response cost way. The people that eat "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook" menus, there's nothing to rebel against. They're not going to say, I'm dying for a piece of pie. That's fine. Have a piece of pie.
KING: Can restaurants do this?
MCGRAW: Absolutely. They are. We have restaurants all over the country using high response cost, high yield recipes we've been working on with all year long our show. They have those menu items available in their restaurants.
KING: A food you like is tofu?
KING: It is an excellent weight product?
MCGRAW: It is an excellent weight product. I don't want it everyday for every meal. But properly seasoned and properly prepared it can be a very satisfying food.
KING: Do you say you can't ever eat pizza again?
MCGRAW: Absolutely not. Look, here's the thing.
KING: You can have a slice or two of pizza?
MCGRAW: Of course. It's the pattern that you get into. What you need to understand is, as I said, there are 7 keys. And one of the keys is exercise. You exercise all the time. You walk?
MCGRAW: You're out there chugging along, you get along pretty quick, too. You get your heart rate up. And that's what it's all about. I saw one of the popular diet books the other day, I was in a bookstore. There was the book and it had a sticker on the front of it that said no exercise. You got to be kidding me. You got to be kidding me. You have got to break a sweat. You don't have to become an athlete. You don't have to go do something that intimidates you, but you've to get moving.
MCGRAW: There is not a magic pull pill out there. Now, one of the things I deal with in the ultimate weight solution, is that we have what are called weight loss resistant patients. There are patients, my older sister, Diena, who lives in Evansville, Indiana is one of them. She's a diabetic, so she's on insulin, so she has blood sugar issues. She's on Pregnezone and different types of steroids to handle other health problems she has. She probably has 70 or 80 pounds of water, fluid on her and she's very resistant to losing weight.
Now, that doesn't mean that she can't. In fact, she is. She's lost 30 or 40 pounds in the last few months. And when I finally got her started on the program she could walk for about 30 seconds across a room and she had to sit down. Now, she's doing 30 minutes a day on a treadmill at a brisk pace and doing water aerobics, because she's starting to exercise. So, her inches are coming down, her weight coming down and her health is going up.
KING: I know you're not a doctor of medicine and nutrition, but what do you make of what is certainly the most popular, I don't want to call it a fad, it's more than a fad, low carb?
MCGRAW: Well, you're right. I am not a medical doctor and I'm not a nutritionist. And interestingly enough, obesity, while it is clearly a medical disorder that can create serious other health problems, and in fact, be life-threatening the remedies for it are largely psychological. If you go to an internist today and you have a really overweight patient, they don't have the time or inclination to deal with them. There's been a lot of writing about that in internal medicine, they talk about we're not equipped to deal with these because it's a lifestyle thing.
KING: What do you think of low carbs?
MCGRAW: Low carb is a problem in that you lose a lot of water. If you go on high protein, you're going to lose a lot of water weight. And the first time you take a bite of a biscuit, boom, you will go right back up. You need to be careful where you are when you do that. You have to have a balanced diet. You have to have the right kind of carbs, the right kind of fats the right kind of proteins and it has to all be in balance. Anything that is extreme is probably not in your best interests.
KING: Right back with Dr. Phil. The new book is "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook, just went on sale. Don't go away.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: These are the pants I wore on the video and sent to Dr. Phil. They totally are huge on me. Yay for me.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Achieving the goals I set out to do has been the most amazing experience. I want to prove to other people out there you can be pushing 300 pounds and you can turn it all around if you really want to, with the seven keys, you can.
MCGRAW: Barbara is an absolute star.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I cannot believe where I am today.
(END VIDEO CLIP) (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
DAVID LETTERMAN, HOST, "DAVID LETTERMAN SHOW": This is a list of the thoughts that are going through the mind of this man right there at the Daytime Emmy Awards.
MCGRAW: If I play my cards right, I really think I have a shot with that Ellen Degeneres.
MCGRAW: Because deep down, I crave validation from others as a substitute for the affection that was denied me as a child or some psychobabble like that. I don't know.
LETTERMAN: And the No. 1 thought going through his mind at the Daytime Emmy Awards?
MCGRAW: Me, three Emmy nominations. Freud, zero Emmy nominations! Know what I'm saying?
KING: Do you enjoy the poking fun bit?
MCGRAW: I guess might as well because I don't think it's going away. Somehow I guess it's the southern accent. People just love.
KING: I think it's your size, your approach, your ability to communicate well on the tube, and you -- and the time with Oprah and then extending it, your own -- I mean, you're a -- you are now a major major American personality.
MCGRAW: People sure are having fun poking fun at me. I take it in the right spirit. Look, if you're thin-skinned, if you can't laugh at yourself and have a good time with it, you don't need to be in this industry. You know that.
KING: There is another thing. There is a Dr. Phil doll or whatever. What is Dr. Phil?
MCGRAW: That's not a doll, that's a muppet. That that's Dr. Feel. F-E-E-L.
MCGRAW: Dr. Feel is a muppet that has been designed, he sounds like me and he looks like me, except he's got a little more fur on top of his head than I do, that's been designed to help children learn about feelings, to help them learn about how to identify when they're feeling sad, scared, angry, frustrated, all the different emotions that kids go through, because these are abstractions that a lot of children don't have symbols for, they don't have words for. So "Sesame Street," as is their tendency, is to do responsible programming for these children, has created Dr. Feel. He has a show, and he has guests on it, like I do, and it's really a lot of fun.
KING: Back to the week. You set up a no-fail kitchen, too, right?
MCGRAW: Yes. Look, when people want to lose weight, this isn't brain surgery. If you'll just stop believing the promos, everybody telling you it's going to be easy and realize that you're responsible and you're accountable. Research has shown us, No. 1, that we're a product of our environment. If there's a plate of cookies sitting here on the desk and it's just there all the time, we're much more likely to eat those than if they're not there. If they're still at the store or if they're frozen or not in sight all the time.
Not brain surgery, but clean up your environment, where you don't have to fight impulse all the time. Another powerful finding is that people do most of their damage in very isolated windows during the day. For example, some women tell me that they eat right when they get home from work, you know, they're tired, they come in, kick their shoes off, drop their stuff, go into the kitchen and they'll kind of graze around and eat a couple thousand calories before they even start dinner. A lot of them will say that after the kids go to bed and they finally get a few minutes of quiet time, they'll sit down and watch a favorite program and nibble all the way through it. They'll do most of their weight damage during those narrow windows. So if we'll simply design our day so we're doing incompatible behaviors during those times, make that the time you take your bath, do something you can't be tempted with eating, you don't have to be strong all day.
MCGRAW: It is logical if you just think about it. That's why we tried to connect it together. What do I eat? In the "Ultimate Weight Solution" cookbook, there's a 14-day rapid start program at the beginning, that if you'll go on that 14 days, it is a great jump-start to get you moving down the road.
KING: How do people who get to be 400 pounds, that's unfathomable. MCGRAW: It is. Most people are very judgmental of that. The truth is nobody ever started out with that objective in mind, but there's something that I call the personal truth, and that's that thing that you believe about yourself, when you don't have your social mask on, when nobody's looking, nobody's listening, it's just you. We all have a personal truth, what we believe about ourselves, and I'll guarantee you, people generate the results in their life that they believe they deserve. If I see somebody that's 400, 500, 600 pounds, I'll guarantee you that's what they believe they deserve in this life. You have to.
MCGRAW: It is either a punishment or a settling. They just settle for it because they don't believe that they are worthy of a great body image, an active lifestyle, a healthy, fun, engaging relationship. They've used food for other than nutritional purposes. But I promise you, if you look at somebody who is in a terrible place in their life, at least in part, they believe that's what they deserve. I'm not talking about if someone is hurt in a car wreck, or they're afflicted with a disease that is not a matter of lifestyle choice, but when you see people who are in a station in life that is a product of choice, they made those choices in concert with what they believe they deserve. KING: We'll be back with our remaining moments of Dr. Phil. It's always great to have him with us.
MCGRAW: Time to make a house call.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's Dr. Phil.
MCGRAW: This isn't about starving yourself.
What have you got in your hand there?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: A light beer.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: On your mark, get set, go!
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's so incredible that Ann Marie (ph) was able to get around that track.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nine bags of clothes that are going to Goodwill for good use.
MCGRAW: I toast every one of you.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am still going to keep the seven keys right up here because this is not for now, it's forever.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: This program has changed my life. I can't put into words what it's meant to me. I'm still overwhelmed by it.
ROBIN MCGRAW, WIFE OF DR. PHIL: If you have chicken fried steak, you never have it without mashed potato on the side.
MCGRAW: Did I hear you say chicken fried steak?
ROBIN MCGRAW: Yes. Yes. You sure did. I have a little secret to tell everyone.
MCGRAW: This is where you kiss the cook.
ROBIN MCGRAW: Everyday when I cook, this man comes in and starts snacking. So here we are, I'm prepared today. Delicious, low calorie snacks from the cookbook. Mini pizzas, sun dried tomatoes, low fat cheese, wheat crackers.
MCGRAW: This a funny shaped potato. Isn't this like where you fast forward and it's all done.
ROBIN MCGRAW: Please don't try to cut my finger off. He is so trying to beat me. I can't believe it. I started it. That's what life is like in the McGraw kitchen.
KING: You're a lucky man, Phil. The book is "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook." Ahh, the word we have not mentioned that came up there, snacks. And you look like a snack grabber.
MCGRAW: Yes. That's the environmental control. I'm a nibbler. So if I have things around that are counterproductive for me to be nibbling on, I'm in danger. So we simply clean up our environment and don't have things around that are counterproductive to be nibbling on. The things that she gives me as snacks are high in fiber, and so they're very filling and they're low in fat. And so they're things that it's really OK for me to eat. She'll put out things it's OK for you to eat that. Robin runs a really good kitchen.
KING: Are you writing this for aesthetics or health?
MCGRAW: It's really about health. I have had so many tragedies in my own family regarding weight. I lost my father years ahead of his time -- to a heart problem, secondary to obesity. He was substantially overweight. I have two nephews that are between 450 and 500 pounds. I had aunts that were like 5'2", 350 pounds. We've buried almost all of them now. I have seen it destroy the lives of so many people and destroy their health. And I know that people are motivated by the aesthetics, but when they find out -- when we did the ultimate weight loss challenge on the show, we had 13 opponents.
We did all their lab work in the beginning and oh my gosh, high in cholesterol, triglycerides, blood sugar, kidney functions were bad, liver functions bad. They were just all over the chart. And we checked them 30 days into the program and all of those labs that were out here in the periphery started centering up. At two months, almost every one of them was totally within normal range. And it absolutely adds years to your life. You can make choices today that will add years to your life tomorrow. And if you will do it, your self-esteem goes up, body image goes up, your quality of life, just because of what you can engage and what you can do goes up. And if you have children at home, you're giving them their parents for many years more.
KING: What suggestion do you give for that first motivation, that beginning, the hardest part of all?
MCGRAW: Days turn into weeks, weeks turn into months, months turn into years, you look back and go oh, my gosh. What I wasn't people to realize the next six months is going to go by whether you're doing something about your weight or whether you're not, the clock is going to tick. It's not about will power. It's not about getting all pumped up and excited, and "rah rah," I'm going to go out there and lose all this weight. It's about making a mature decision that says, look, he's right. I've got to start this. I don't even need -- I don't want people to worry about what they weigh in the beginning. If you go on the rapid start program that's in the cookbook, you will lose substantial weight in the first couple of weeks, in the first month. We did a booty camp. I said, OK, you women, I want four women who want to lose 20 to 30 pounds in six to eight weeks. We picked four, we put them through the program and of course they lost the weight. They said we never believed we could do it. It's just not that hard. You have to set your lifestyle up.
And it begins by work going through the seven keys. Clean up your environment, identify your impulse zones, get rid of all those impulse foods and put high response high yield foods in there and then start living your life consistent with what we line out for you and it happens. It's not easy, it's just do-able. Then you get all this momentum, before you know it, you look like Larry King.
MCGRAW: Thank you, Larry. The book, "The Ultimate Weight Solution Cookbook: Recipes for Weight Loss Freedom" by Dr. Phil McGraw, the author of the number one best times seller, "The Ultimate Weight Solution." Free Press the publisher. And the book is now available everywhere. And I'll be back in two minutes to tell you about tomorrow night don't go away.
KING: Thanks for joining us on this edition of LARRY KING LIVE with Dr. Phil. Stay tuned for more news around the clock on your most trusted name in news, CNN. See you tomorrow night. Good night.
Chris Pine, the Next Action Hero
There he is, a 33-year-old movie star, improbably handsome, out drinking with friends on a drizzly autumn Saturday in London, chatting up girls, getting a little buzzed, letting loose – an indulgence he's just recently begun to allow himself. Chris Pine has a week's worth of stubble going and a gray knit cap pulled low over his dirty-blond hair, but inevitably, he keeps getting recognized.
One of Pine's pals is wearing sneakers, so they're having trouble getting into a club. They're stuck waiting in the rain when the hostess spots Pine and waves them through. He thanks her, and she offers a fame-besotted smile. "Don't worry," she says, gazing into familiar pale-blue eyes. "I loved you in 'The Hangover.' " Bradley Cooper – in her club!
ALSO: Building a Bigger Action Hero
Then there's the guy who tells Pine how totally psyched he is to be at the same bar as Chris Hemsworth – Thor himself. And yet another dude, who asks Pine what movies he's been in – Pine lies, tells him, 'Captain America.' "Oh, my God, yes!" the dude says, thrilled to be meeting Chris Evans.
Worst of all, there's the pretty young British woman. "I'm going to guess you're an actor," she says. "You're American, you're here on business. . . . "
"That's an incredibly on-the-nose guess," Pine replies.
They chat, and it seems to be going OK, until she starts apologizing: "I'm so sorry," she says. "I don't know who you are."
"Sweetheart, it is totally cool," he says, thinking, "and I have no idea who the fuck you are." But she keeps doing it, until he loses patience: "If you apologize one more time, I'm going to have to leave this conversation."
"I'm sorry," she blurts, for the fifth time. Pine walks away.
"I clearly haven't made a good enough impression on people," Pine says the next day, laughing. "My go-to line when it's the résumé game is that I'm either Chris Evans or Ryan Reynolds."
To clear up any confusion: Pine is the guy who plays a young Captain James T. Kirk in the new 'Star Trek' movies, the one who's about to take on the late Tom Clancy's CIA-analyst hero in January's 'Jack Ryan: Shadow Recruit.' He held his own against Denzel Washington in the runaway-train flick 'Unstoppable,' started his movie career as a tween eye-candy prince opposite Anne Hathaway in 'The Princess Diaries 2.' He's been in London since August shooting 'Into the Woods,' a film version of the Stephen Sondheim musical fairy tale, in which he plays another prince, this time the one who gets with Cinderella.
There are so many of them now, these blue-eyed, blond-haired, movie-star Chrisses and Ryans, each more jacked and CGI-perfect than the next, and Pine is uncomfortable with what he sees as an unhealthy homogeneity. "The mass audience doesn't want to see you if you aren't perfect," he says, leaning against a brick wall in Tinello, a posh Italian restaurant dark enough to cast unnecessarily flattering shadows on his cheekbones. "If you don't look a certain way, if you don't have big pecs and great skin and the perfect eyes. And it's unfortunate, because kids are growing up with body image dysmorphia because not everyone is represented on the screen.
"I get it," he adds, sitting there in a gray T-shirt, loose at the neck, with his own big pecs and great skin and perfect eyes. "For me to talk shit on it? I'm one of the guys!"
He's too smart, too polite to actually say it, but it's pretty clear that Pine wants to be the best, the deepest, the most lasting of the Chrisses, if not of his whole generation of leading men. "There's certainly the ego-based me that is very competitive," he says. Pine is playing a long game, honing his craft and his deltoids, doing theater in his spare time, making savvy, diverse film choices – the Sondheim musical, an obnoxious boss's son in 'Horrible Bosses 2,' a character part as a ZZ Top bearded billionaire in the comedy 'Stretch.'
In Hollywood's new audience-tested, foreign-market-pandering reality, proven franchises – brand names – have become more important than the actors in them: That's why 'Star Trek' director J.J. Abrams was able to cast an all-but-unknown Pine as Kirk in the first place. But now that the two Treks have made a combined $850 million worldwide, Pine is a certified leading man, with looks, acting chops, physical grace, and bankability that make him a solid choice to anchor pretty much any movie that needs a fit, square-jawed white guy at its core. He's hoping the franchises will be a safety net that will allow him to experiment. "The nice thing about 'Star Trek' and, God willing, Jack, is I can always kind of hop back and do that thing," he says. "But the past couple years for me were just trying to really figure out what I want to do."
Pondering it all, he can't help yearning for a different era of film. "Look at the movies of the sixties and seventies. They were making a different kind of movie then. Would 'Network' ever be made now? No. Would 'Kramer vs. Kramer' ever be made now? No. Would 'Tootsie' ever be made now? Probably not. Robert Altman films? Never.
"I'm not saying that the action/science-fiction genre is bad in itself," he clarifies. "I make those films. I'm just saying that the studios have put all their cards on black."
Again, he's part of the problem, and he doesn't offer a solution. Even if he never saw himself as a franchise guy, he's now holding down two of them. "It definitely wasn't what I had signed up for," he says, plunging his fork into a plate of burrata cheese ("Holy fucking wow! I love this"). "It just kind of seemed to be where my life took me. If I would have planned it, I would have had what Gosling has, that kind of art-house career."
On some level, the I-just-fell-into-this talk doesn't ring true. Growing up in the San Fernando Valley, he was a driven, compulsively well-behaved kid, a "golden boy" who thought he had to be perfect, who always did all his homework, even if an actual goal for all his striving remained elusive. His expectations for himself were high, and only got higher in adulthood. He's a cautious man, a thinking man, more Spock than Kirk, really: Ask a simple question about his life or career, and you may well get a full minute of silence as he agonizes over the answer like Hamlet hitting Final Jeopardy, eyes drifting as mental gears turn. (He says that one of the keys to film acting – especially the kind that involves shooting guns – is letting the audience see you think. Clearly, he's got that part down.) He'll order a lovely $455 Tuscan red ("Sometimes it's worth it," he says, though he's not paying) and take down half of it with his pappardelle with wild-boar ragout but fail to loosen up.
"I'm surprised how hard on himself he is," says Abrams. "It was remarkable how often he would do something well and then for some reason be furious at himself that he hadn't done it better. He gives himself so much grief when something doesn't hit as he wants it to – as if we can't just go and do another take."
Pine had zero interest in acting in his early years, focusing instead on baseball. "I was really good at 12," he says. "I was a fucking stud." But he started to find himself outclassed as he got older, and he didn't deal well with failure on the field. "When I used to strike out," he says, "I would, like, smash the bat, get some kind of catharsis out of it. I'm much better now with that."
In hindsight, he admits, his path seems almost inevitable. He was essentially bred for it. His dad is the ubiquitous journeyman actor Robert Pine, who's been on pretty much every TV show ever made, from Bonanza to Curb Your Enthusiasm, and most famously played Sergeant Joe Getraer on CHiPs. Chris' mom, Gwynne Gilford, was an actress before she quit to become a psychotherapist and acting coach her mother, Anne Gwynne, was a World War II pinup and a Universal contract player (she co-starred in the 1940 horror film 'Black Friday' with Bela Lugosi and Boris Karloff).
"You never encourage your children to attempt this business," Robert Pine said a few years back. "It can be just too painful and heartbreaking. But if they show a will, and will not be denied, you do a 180 and give them all the support and encouragement you can." Pine is tight with his parents, and his older sister, Katie, too – like their mother, an actor turned psychologist. "Gwynne and I take such delight in our kids' closeness," Robert has said. "They make each other laugh." On Chris' wrist is a silver bracelet Katie gave him. "It reminds me of my family," he says.
Chris is the third-generation product of a rarefied Hollywood gene pool. His looks have a test-tube precision, caveman eyebrows and aggressively jutting jaw balanced with delicate, almost feminine lips and those Sinatra eyes. It's hard, then, not to roll your eyes when he starts with the stories about a teenage ugly-duckling phase. He's aware that it's a horrendous cliché, that every crazy-hot actress says the same thing, but he swears it's true: He was skinny, bespectacled (he wears contacts now), and, more to the point, had truly horrendous skin.
And after baseball stardom faded, he wasn't left with much. "I was kind of a lost, shy kid in need of encouragement," he says. "Scared, pimply-faced, geeky, in huge coke-bottle glasses and a hat. A very sensitive kid. The last thing I would have ever imagined is I would be acting on film. Obviously, when I had horrible acne, I would naturally retreat. You don't want to look at the world and you don't want the world to look at you, and so when I was 15 or whatever, I got really into writing and books and studying."
Pine went to the nurturing, Quaker-influenced Oakwood School (Samuel L. Jackson's and Frank Zappa's kids are fellow alumni). "I can't imagine what it would have been like if I were in a public school," he says. "I would have probably gotten beaten. My school was very inclusive. There were no jocks there weren't labeled groups of kids."
Several times in high school, he broke sufficiently free from his temporary shyness to get up and sing in front of his classmates at their Quaker-style assemblies – even doing "Let's Get It On" in falsetto. He loved performing, how it allowed his anxieties to slip away as he lived fully in the moment, but when he wasn't actually singing, he didn't think much about it.
When he got to Berkeley, he was terrified, looking for a place where he'd belong. For the English major, fraternities didn't seem like an option. "Fuck, no," he says. "They always just seemed, like, aggressive and violent and, like, beer. It was way not my temperament." So he started doing theater, where there were girls and validation and friendly oddballs. "I was looking for someone to be like, 'Oh! You're handsome you're good,' and that felt fuckin' great. And theater kids, especially at Berkeley, are fuckin' weird . . . and I felt right at home."
After graduation, his dad hooked him up with casting directors, and he started nailing auditions. He soon found himself in 'The Princess Diaries 2,' and then played a similar hot-guy role in the fluffy Lindsay Lohan vehicle "Just My Luck," where the sight of a shirtless Pine so flusters Lohan that she dumps a whole bottle of detergent in a laundry machine. "I didn't give a shit," he says. "I was 24 and I was in New Orleans and making more money than I ever thought anybody deserved to have. And I was getting paid to learn to act basically."
He had trouble accepting how much his looks played into those early successes – and still claims to be unable to process it. "That's been the oddest part of this whole journey," he says, "and one that I take with a major grain of salt and smile and think, like, my God, this is pretty funny."
He describes life before 'Star Trek' as "pretty much work, work, work. I was just a very results-oriented kid." He spent a substantial amount of time in New York and L.A. doing theater, which he took to more naturally than film. He played the lead in a Los Angeles production of the typically brutal Neil LaBute play 'Fat Pig,' winning over the playwright himself – and impressing a Paramount exec in the audience, who happened to be looking for a Captain Kirk. "He just struck me as a guy who was serious," says LaBute. "It wasn't a guy who was looking over his shoulder thinking that this would get him the next job, like, 'I'll play this guy and then I'll get one of those tight-ass 'Star Trek' outfits.' People see a handsome, well-built kid and they go, 'Oh, he'd be good at this' or 'Oh, he's perfect to reboot that.' I think he's a really gifted actor who happens to have the looks and the physique to support these tentpole movies but has the smarts and the desire to do all kinds of things."
LaBute was almost simultaneously working with Pine's dad on an indie movie, Lakeview Terrace. "That was kind of an interesting back and forth, having both father and son around," he says. "I see his dad as the best kind of actor out there. One that takes his craft seriously and doesn't look at a one-episode arc as a character on a show, as just work. So I can see that seriousness of purpose in both people."
At that point, Pine was looking for deeper and darker roles, not a sci-fi thing with phasers. "It's like the ghost of James Dean was telling me, 'You must be brooding and complicated and be in really, um, artistically worthwhile films,' " he says, sipping wine. "My agent came to me and was like, 'What do you think about 'Star Trek'?' I was like, 'If anything, I want to take a break, reassess, figure my life out. The last thing I want to do is a fucking science-fiction film.' I was hoping for something dark, brutal something where I'd cry a lot. And then I realized how much of a game changer it can be, and the meeting with J.J. [Abrams] was so fun."
It's hard not to wonder: Did Pine pursue 'Star Trek' – and Jack Ryan – because he knows his dad never quite got these star-making opportunities?
He shakes his head, furrows the eyebrows. He doesn't need to pause before this answer. "I just don't think of my father that way," he says. "This is a really hard business I've been incredibly lucky. Incredibly lucky. And my father never made a 'Star Trek,' but he's been a successful actor for 50 years, put two children through private school and college, and has worked in every medium of our business. So I view my father as a great success, as a superstar. Because in many ways it's much harder than when you get to sit where I am, where as long as you don't completely fuck up, the door will stay open. I think what my father has done has been much, much, much harder."
The day after his bar crawl, Pine sleeps until noon, and is still waking up by the time we meet an hour later at the Punch Bowl, a faux-traditional pub owned by Guy Ritchie. He's hungry, and we quickly switch venues to the nearby Soho House, where he's a member – we're seated at a plush booth with magical speed. He's also close enough pals with the stylish young maître d' that he asks about Pine's night out – until Pine points, with reflexive caution, to my digital recorder. Pine is wearing a white T-shirt over what appear to be the same black jeans and boots from the night before, plus a blue leather jacket ("That must have been a weird-looking cow," he says). He's not particularly hungover – he paced himself. And many of his nights out are even more civilized: Friday evening was spent with co-star Emily Blunt and her husband – they saw a Hollywood-themed play, 'The Drowned Man,' which he'd already caught in New York.
Pine's politics are far left even for Hollywood – he's bookmarked Truthdig and 'Mother Jones,' and has grown disillusioned with Obama, whom he went door-to-door for in Nevada in 2008. Despite Tom Clancy's obvious right-wing inclinations, Pine always had a soft spot for the Jack Ryan movies. He went to Alec Baldwin, the first actor to play Ryan (and not exactly a Tea Partier himself), for advice. Baldwin simply grabbed him by the shoulders and said, "Just do it, and don't look back."
Pine particularly liked that, unlike the brash, un-cerebral Kirk, Ryan's defining trait is intelligence. Instead of guys wanting to test his toughness by fighting him in bars, "maybe they can just throw me a puzzle. Like, solve this Sudoku, asshole. You think you're smart? Solve this algorithm!" 'Shadow Recruit,' set mostly in Moscow, brings the Jack Ryan character out of the Cold War and into the present day – when the story begins, Jack isn't even a CIA analyst yet. "Jack Ryan isn't a paid assassin," director Kenneth Branagh has said. "He's not a man coming off a program. He's got his brain, and he's got a desire to do something, to serve in some way."
The movie has all the action you'd expect from a spy thriller, but for Pine, the physical demands are the easy part. What's hard is bringing depth to Jack Ryan, who's a blank slate, a heroic everyman figure who's there to react to the excitement around him.
"Oftentimes, what you're asked to do is just be, which is hard because as an actor you want to do things to get noticed. You have to hold those things back to be an anchor, without getting in the way of the bad guy doing the accent or whatever."
We finish lunch and walk around Mayfair, the ultra-upscale neighborhood where Pine is renting an apartment. As we pass a bar's courtyard, a slim twentysomething brunette in blue vinyl pants looks up from her cellphone and gives Pine a huge smile, with meaningful, almost hungry eye contact. It's not altogether clear whether she recognizes him, but it doesn't matter: He smiles back, as pleased as if it were a rare occurrence.
Pine ended a relationship with model Dominique Piek last April and then was spotted out with another brunette model, Amanda Frances. He once half-joked that he'd like to be a George Clooney–style perpetual bachelor, and then backed away from the quote. Now he says, again, that he's not ready for a relationship.
"I have a lot of fucking growing up to do," he says. "I'm a relatively young guy and I feel like I'm hitting my stride with my work. I don't know if I have the capacity at the moment to be a good partner to somebody. I could meet someone tomorrow and change my mind, but that's how I feel on this Sunday afternoon." (A month later, pictures appear of him in Paris with one Iris Björk Jóhannesdóttir, a blonde, 23-year-old former Miss Reykjavík.)
Truth is, he does admire Clooney – but who doesn't? "I don't know him at all, but I enjoy watching him. He takes it seriously, but he's not gloating down the red carpet. He's a movie star – and there's something glamorous and wonderful that we all kind of buy into. People enjoy George Clooney, and he's enjoying it."
Lately, Pine is doing his best to walk that path. "When Heath Ledger died," he says, "I was making the first 'Star Trek,' and I didn't know him at all, but it really hit me. He was my age, basically, 28. Life is so short. It's obviously a trite thing to say, but it could not be any truer. It would be such a waste given all the opportunities I've been given not to have as much fun as I possibly can."
So for the first time in his life, he's letting himself be a little irresponsible. Hence the drinking, the girls, the sleeping until noon. "I feel like I'm Benjamin Button-ing myself," he says with a laugh, "It's like as I get older I'll be the guy with the Lamborghini." In fact, he already has a Porsche 911 Carrera S, which makes it hard to obey speed limits. "It's the architecture of the car – it wants to go fast." Three years ago, he bought himself a $3 million house in Los Feliz as well, with a view of the Hollywood sign.
He wishes he could go back and shake his 18-year-old self, and tell him, "Have fun." "For whatever reason, I didn't misbehave as a kid. I studied hard, did my homework – and it's all unraveling as I get older."
Pine has been careful about the roles he takes – but if anything, he wants to be less cautious in the future. He doesn't want to get trapped in what he calls "the bubble life of movie stardom."
"I've always just been very cognizant of how easily it all can be taken away," he says, standing under the gray London sky. "You may be great-looking, you may be charming. But it doesn't fucking guarantee squat." He says it again, as if the idea pleases him, as if he's picturing that bubble popping: "It's just not guaranteed."
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Lake-Lehman Indoor Color Guard receives first place at TIA Regionals
The 2019 Lake-Lehman Indoor Color Guard competed in the Tournament Indoor Association Chapter 2 Championships on Saturday, April 27 at Souderton High School, receiving received first place for its show “Something in the Water.”
The Region 2 Championships was the last competition before the group competes at 2019 TIA Atlantic Coast Championships in Wildwood, New Jersey on May 3.
The community is invited to cheer the Indoor Color Guard and Indoor Percussion groups on and see a preview of their shows on Tuesday, April 30 at Lake-Lehman High School. Doors will open at 7:30 p.m.
The group is under the direction of Brian Bacon with Jess Geiger.
Members of the 2019 Lake-Lehman Indoor Color Guard are, from left, first row, Mia Qualey, Jaina Neyhard, Faith Depiero, Talyia Adamitz, Gennifer Symons, Athena Evans, Jacklyn Watkins, Jules Quare. Second row, Sierra Vogan, Megan Judge, Miranda Olexy, Jessica McMahon, Madison Budzak, Emma Simon, Allysa Shalata.
He said: 'No matter what technique you use, you should get the same value for the expansion rate of the universe today.
'Fortunately, living in a void helps resolve this tension.'
Scientists first suggested that, in the context of the structure of the universe, our galaxy resides in an enormous empty space back in 2013.
While the finding that the Milky Way (artist's impression pictured) is one of the quieter cosmic neighbourhoods may seem bleak, it does help to resolve a major source of tension in our understanding of the Universe (stock image)
THE MILKY WAY
The Milky Way is thought to be 120,000 light years across and contains about 300 billion stars.
This makes it a 'middleweight' galaxy with the largest galaxy known, IC 1101, containing more than 100 trillion stars.
On a clear night, when you look up into the night sky the most you can see from any one point on the Earth is about 2,500 stars.
The researchers found that the region contained far fewer galaxies, stars and planets than expected.
The area was named KBC after the trio of researchers behind the discovery, which also included the University of Hawaii's Lennox Cowie, in 2014.
And the discovery of voids in the structure of space could help explain the discrepancy in measurements.
This is because there is far greater matter outside the void, which exerts a slightly larger gravitational pull.
One method to measure the expansion of the Universe, a value known as the Hubble Constant, uses nearby supernovae as they have a predictable amount of energy.
The discovery of voids in the structure of space could help explain the discrepancy in measurements of how fast the universe is expanding. Pictured - A map of the local universe as observed by the Sloan Digital Sky Survey
Another technique uses the Cosmic Microwave Background, the leftover light from the Big Bang.
'It is often really hard to find consistent solutions between many different observations,' said Dr Barger.
'What Ben has shown is that the density profile that Keenan measured is consistent with cosmological observables.
'One always wants to find consistency, or else there is a problem somewhere that needs to be resolved.'
WHEN GALAXIES COLLIDE
It's widely accepted than in 5 billion years our Milky Way will collide with the nearby Andromeda galaxy - but what will happen when it does?
Scientists revealed the intricate process that will take place, with the two central supermassive black holes merging into one, back in 2014.
And the newly formed super-galaxy, dubbed 'Milkomeda', will also ultimately spell disaster for Earth as our planet is flung out into interstellar space.
A simulation was created by a number of institutions led by the International Centre for Radio Astronomy Research (Icrar) in Western Australia.
In the simulation it can be seen how the two galaxies will interact as they approach each other.
First, in a tentative meeting, they will 'swoop' past each other, possibly disrupting some of the orbits of stars in the arms of each spiral galaxy.
Then, after separating, the two galaxies will accelerate towards each other again.
As Andromeda is larger than the Milky Way, with one trillion stars in the former compared to about 300 billion in the latter, it will technically be the one 'eating' our galaxy.
The Milky Way is also expected to 'eat' two nearby dwarf galaxies, the Large and Small Magellanic Clouds, at some point in the future.
3 1/2 Degrees- People Who Know People
Father's Day Special with Heather Barnes Tocquigny and Jennifer Tocquigny
Two millennials and one Dad create a fun show on Father’s Day. Our signature questions are featured with “what is the most important gift we can give one another.” Enjoy this delightful conversation that embraces relationships and love with Heather Tocquigny Barnes, Jennifer Tocquigny and their Dad, Rick Tocquigny, co-founder of Success Made to Last.
Jane Hoover- former VP of Government Affairs for P&G shares exclusive stories on Nixon and Johnson..… and Robert Redford!
Jane Hoover relays the insider story on Brice Harlow, mentor of LBJ, Richard Nixon and four other presidents. Hear about “trust as a currency.” Enjoy the encounter of Jane with Robert Redford, who interviewed Jane to prepare for his role in All the President’s Men.
Blueprinting your future by unpacking the past with Dennis Tocquigny
Success Made to Last is on a quest to discover best version people and their individual blueprints for their future. Hear this provocative conversation with Dennis Tocquigny that unpacks his past to help him discover his best future.
Pat Smith, wife of Emmitt Smith, riffs about motherhood, faith and life with Emmitt.
Pat Smith is one of our favorite guests, speaking intimately about her life, competing for Miss America, loving her Mom, and the importance of mentors in her life.
This show is presented by www.Gracefully-Yours.com greeting cards. We use these cards to celebrate birthdays and to encourage others to practice greatness. Their mentoring cards #145 are the best we have ever seen. The recipients of the cards love the sentiment and appreciate the personal touch.
Kathryn Spivak, daughter of famed economist and author Peter Drucker talks about her Dad.
Peter Drucker would be proud of his children, especially Kathryn Spivak. Listen to the heartwarming stories of her Dad. Out of his goodness and charity came some of the best known quotes for our business acumen.
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